Tayda's test strip

[Tayda_Lenny]

Just got this from Tayda.... :(

The one on the left is the unused one.

1918

[Duke]

What does the green color mean?? I hope not what I think it means.

[Tayda_Lenny]

I guess it means she's spilling sugar and I have to get her to the vet... :(

[Duke]

Oh, not good! I'm shocked! I havn't purchased the strips to know. My prayers are with Tayda. She is in good hands for the best care.

(((hugs)))

[bellabasenji]

aww, i hope this is not what it looks like. i would retest several times. i just bought my test strips today and i am worried about doing the first one... our prayers are with you.:(

[lvoss]

If anyone needs to check their test strips, dip an unused strip in some flat Sprite, it should change color. You can also add a little Karo syrup to some water and test that.

I am so sorry to see Tayda's strip changed. I hope that the vet tests show that it has been caught early and that she responds well to the protocol.

[agilebasenji]

I'm so sorry, but please know there have been many advances since Fanconi first appeared. It is no longer a death sentance. And we're all pulling for you.

[lvoss]

i would retest several times.
It is important for everyone who is strip testing to know that in the early stages of Fanconi Syndrome dogs may spill sugar intermittently. So if you get a positive test one day and a negative the next or even later that day, still take your dog to a vet and get the bloodwork run, it may mean you have caught it in its very earliest stages.

[seko]

I am sorry for you and Tayda but at least you caught it early!

I am dreading every results of the strip test!

[nomrbddgs]

I'm so sorry to see the strip change.

[Schouiffy]

condolences on your test strip findings... at least you were a responsible owner and now you have a early heads up. Tayda is so lucky to have you for a mum!

[tanza]

I guess it means she's spilling sugar and I have to get her to the vet... :(

I am so sorry to hear/see that.... and yes, important now to get her to the Vet for Blood Gases..... and if you have not done it yet, take the Fanconi Protocol with Dr. Gonto's contact information for your Vet also.

Good luck.... and hugs.

[tanza]

Important that you also let Tad know about Tayda's strip test results.

[Tayda_Lenny]

Oh yeah, I emailed Tad with the stick in my hand. I've also already had a lengthy conversation with Kelli about it.... i didn't sleep at all last night... ugh. I don't even really have a normal vet here yet so I'm searching right now....

should i start her on the protocol now even before I get to the vet to get her blood gases done?

I called the em vet that did Lennys obstruction surgery and they straight up told me that although they have the machine, they don't have a vet that is good at "getting arterial blood"..... whatever that means. they recommended Tufts University and Angell Memorial Hospital, which both appear to be about 2 hours from me. ACK

[tanza]

Oh yeah, I emailed Tad with the stick in my hand. I've also already had a lengthy conversation with Kelli about it.... i didn't sleep at all last night... ugh. I don't even really have a normal vet here yet so I'm searching right now....

should i start her on the protocol now even before I get to the vet to get her blood gases done?

I called the em vet that did Lennys obstruction surgery and they straight up told me that although they have the machine, they don't have a vet that is good at "getting arterial blood"..... whatever that means. they recommended Tufts University and Angell Memorial Hospital, which both appear to be about 2 hours from me. ACK

No, you can't start the protocol until the blood gases are done as that determines what and how much of the supplements are needed.

Wow... and I find that hard to believe? About them not having a Vet that can get the blood... honestly, I have never heard that? Can you check around with other Vets in the area?

[lvoss]

I called the em vet that did Lennys obstruction surgery and they straight up told me that although they have the machine, they don't have a vet that is good at "getting arterial blood"..... whatever that means. they recommended Tufts University and Angell Memorial Hospital, which both appear to be about 2 hours from me. ACK
It is a Venous Blood Gas test not an Arterial Blood Gas Test. You may want to bring the protocol to the vet's office and talk with them in person.

[tanza]

It is a Venous Blood Gas test not an Arterial Blood Gas Test. You may want to bring the protocol to the vet's office and talk with them in person.

Good point Lisa.... I didn't even pick up on that.... glad that you caught that... guess that's why I thought the comment was so odd....

[tanza]

And remember Dr. Gonto is wonderful about talking to owners/Vets/Techs about everything Fanconi... he is a great resourse....

[lvoss]

Here is the link directly to the protocol, http://www.basenji.org/ClubDocs/fanconiprotocol2003.pdf

If you are having trouble with the vet understanding what needs to be done, have them contact Dr Gonto or you can contact him yourself to make sure you know exactly what Tayda needs done.

[Tayda_Lenny]

Ok, i called about 6 vets in the area and after having to spell b-a-s-e-n-j-i and then f-a-n-c-o-n-i to most of them i was getting really frusterated. but i now have an appointment on wednesday with one of the two "internal medicine" vets in CT who does specialize in kidney malfunction, so i really hope he can help. I will bring dr. gontos protocol with me, and actually i may drop it off before hand so the doc can read through it first.

I'll probably give Dr. Gontos a call myself also to speak with him....

argh... we'll get through this....

thanks to everyone for your support!

meanwhile tayda and lenny are cuddling up to each other in the sunspot and are none the wiser...

[tanza]

Ok, i called about 6 vets in the area and after having to spell b-a-s-e-n-j-i and then f-a-n-c-o-n-i to most of them i was getting really frusterated. but i now have an appointment on wednesday with one of the two "internal medicine" vets in CT who does specialize in kidney malfunction, so i really hope he can help. I will bring dr. gontos protocol with me, and actually i may drop it off before hand so the doc can read through it first.

I'll probably give Dr. Gontos a call myself also to speak with him....

argh... we'll get through this....

thanks to everyone for your support!

meanwhile tayda and lenny are cuddling up to each other in the sunspot and are none the wiser...

The main thing is to get the Blood workup and Blood gases down.... and I think that would be a great idea to drop off the protocol before you go....

[bellabasenji]

It is important for everyone who is strip testing to know that in the early stages of Fanconi Syndrome dogs may spill sugar intermittently. So if you get a positive test one day and a negative the next or even later that day, still take your dog to a vet and get the bloodwork run, it may mean you have caught it in its very earliest stages.
Thank you, I am glad you made me aware of this. I guess I was being an optimist... My heart goes out to Tayda and Mom.:( I finally got Bella to pee in a saucer for me. She looked back at me like "what the heck, Mom" why you want that stuff! (I guess I wasn't sneaky enough). Thank God the color didn't change for Bella. I was worried since this was the first time I did the test (the vet did the first two before she was almost three years old). Tayda really hit home for me and woke me up about Fanconi, previously it was only in the back of my mind... Now she has me fighting tears.

[tanza]

Thank you, I am glad you made me aware of this. I guess I was being an optimist... My heart goes out to Tayda and Mom.:( I finally got Bella to pee in a saucer for me. She looked back at me like "what the heck, Mom" why you want that stuff! (I guess I wasn't sneaky enough). Thank God the color didn't change for Bella. I was worried since this was the first time I did the test (the vet did the first two before she was almost three years old). Tayda really hit home for me and woke me up about Fanconi, previously it was only in the back of my mind... Now she has me fighting tears.

You should consider doing the DNA test then you will know if you have to continue to strip test... and if she did come back as affected, you can be more diligent in testing more often....

[JazzysMom]

Thank you, I am glad you made me aware of this. I guess I was being an optimist... My heart goes out to Tayda and Mom.:( I finally got Bella to pee in a saucer for me. She looked back at me like "what the heck, Mom" why you want that stuff! (I guess I wasn't sneaky enough). Thank God the color didn't change for Bella. I was worried since this was the first time I did the test (the vet did the first two before she was almost three years old). Tayda really hit home for me and woke me up about Fanconi, previously it was only in the back of my mind... Now she has me fighting tears.

You know, you can just put the stick in her urine stream as she goes. It's got to be easier than getting her to pee in a saucer.

or did I miss part of the story?

[JazzysMom]

Just got this from Tayda.... :(

The one on the left is the unused one.



I am so sorry to see that. :( It's my greatest fear as I test Jazzy....I watch that strip with my breath held every time, just waiting for the day that I hope never comes.

[MacPack]

Spilling sugar can be diabetes, too, not sure which I would rather a dog have. If the blood sugar is high and sugar is spilling into the urine, that is diabetes. If the blood sugar is normal, but there is sugar in the urine, that is Fanconi. For years, many vets did not want to follow the Gonto protocol as he is not a vet, but a few years ago it was published in a vet journal so should bear more weight with them. Good luck to you. I know of dogs that have lived well over 10 years with Fanconi, on the protocol. It can be a manageable chronic illness if the dog does well on it, so don't despair yet!

(((Hugs))), Anne

[Janneke]

So sorry to hear about the test strip result.. I can understand that you have a hard time sleeping..:(

You're in my thoughts.

[Tayda_Lenny]

so i have an appointment on wednesday with an internist who supposedly has experience with kidney issues. the lady i spoke to on the phone seemed to think that he would want to do a urinanalysis first to rule out UTI or something else. i said over and over that my goal for the appointment was to get her venous blood gas panel done and can he do that... she of course wouldn't commit to anything over the phone....

[Tayda_Lenny]

incidentally, i contacted the breeder in Rocky Hill, Kokopelli Basenjis to get a recommendation for a basenji saavy vet in the area. she of course knows all about fanconi and the protocol and offered to call her vet and explain the situation to make sure that he was aware that the blood gases were the vital next step. since i already have the appointment on wednesday, im going to keep it, but i'll probably call monday to make a back up appointment with her vet...

[renaultf1]

I'm so sorry to hear about Tayda's test strip. :(

Another thought...do you have any critical care vets in your area. We have one practice that deals with only cancer, kidney, and other special cases. They aren't a regular practice, only disease diagnosis and treatment.

I know 2 hrs is a bit of a drive, but I would seriously consider going to Angell or Tufts at least for the initial diagnosis...especially since it doesn't sound like any of these vets have any idea about even the blood gas aspect. I have so many friends who sing the praises of Angell...and Tufts.

[tanza]

I'm so sorry to hear about Tayda's test strip. :(

Another thought...do you have any critical care vets in your area. We have one practice that deals with only cancer, kidney, and other special cases. They aren't a regular practice, only disease diagnosis and treatment.

I know 2 hrs is a bit of a drive, but I would seriously consider going to Angell or Tufts at least for the initial diagnosis...especially since it doesn't sound like any of these vets have any idea about even the blood gas aspect. I have so many friends who sing the praises of Angell...and Tufts.

Diagnosis, if Fanconi, is pretty straight forward... if they are spilling sugar in their urine, but not high blood sugar in bloodwork, then it is Fanconi... Blood gases are then needed to determine the course of treatment using the protocol. Again, I would take the protocol before hand to the Vet you were seeing on Wednesday. I would also continue to strip test daily. As was already stated they can spill one day and not the next when you catch it early. Happened to a good friend of mine with his dog... he was positive for sugar in the urine one day and then the next 2, none, the following day, he positive for sugar in the urine again. That said, a full blood panel is needed also along with the blood gases.

[Tayda_Lenny]

The emergency care place I called said they had an I-Stat machine, but that they didn't have the cartridge needed to do the blood gasses.

I'm also hearing from these vet techs or whoever answers the phone at the office that it could be just a urinary tract infection. I am trying to push that it is 99% likely to be Fanconi, and i want the urinanalysis, blood work, and blood gasses all in one shot to confirm/deny that.... I really don't want to waste an office visit on them putzing around not doing the tests that I need to figure out Tayda's treatment plan.

The last 3 days Tayda's strips have turned green...

I'm going to keep calling around tomorrow for another vet... I do have an appointment on wednesday with this highly recommended internist, but it's at his satellite site, which Im not sure if they have the machine to do the blood gasses. They said that if needed, he could get me in at the main office the next day or something, but Id rather just find somewhere to have it all done at once.

I am considering going out to Tufts or Angell... but the only thing is Ill have to get her blood gases done every few months, right? and I'd rather it all be done w/ the same doc, on the same machine (and preferably closer to my house) so I don't have to worry about the different machines' calibrations throwing off the interpretation of her values. I've already got an excel spreadsheet set up to track her values... (can you tell I'm an engineer?) lol

[nomrbddgs]

Keep calling vets-but try asking for the vet himself. I have a problem with the secretary at the vets office I go to, but when I talk to the vet himself, it suddenly seems to be less of an issue. He will work with me, the secretary has put me into the "pet people" column. She's told me twice to go elsewhere, but the vets are actually great. Again, try to talk directly to the vet.

[tanza]

Blood gases once on the protocol is every 6 months... as I understand it. And you might want to join the Yahoo Fanconi list for people with Fanconi Affected Basenjis (and others breeds too). And yes, it is nice to be able to have everything done at the same place if possible... Urinary infections are common to Fanconi affected dogs, so would not be surprising if she did have one... Venous blood gas studies can verify an electrolyte imbalance consistent with Fanconi syndrome. And since you are the customer, then the office/Vet should do what you ask to be done.
When was the last time before this that you strip tested? And just being curious, how come you didn't do the DNA test for her?

[Tayda_Lenny]

The last time she was strip tested was probably a year ago when Kelli was dog sitting them.... and she was clear then... I know... I know, I should have kept up with it. I also have been MEANING to order the test kit to send her sample to be DNA tested, and just hadn't done it yet. I know... awful. :( I'm really regretting it now. She had two "accidents" in the house last week(which she never does), and that is what prompted me to go get a bottle of the strips...

I looked on the zandebasenjis site and saw that Tayda has 3 littermates, 2 of which have been tested as carriers. Her parents weren't tested...

[tanza]

The last time she was strip tested was probably a year ago when Kelli was dog sitting them.... and she was clear then... I know... I know, I should have kept up with it. I also have been MEANING to order the test kit to send her sample to be DNA tested, and just hadn't done it yet. I know... awful. :( I'm really regretting it now. She had two "accidents" in the house last week(which she never does), and that is what prompted me to go get a bottle of the strips...

I looked on the zandebasenjis site and saw that Tayda has 3 littermates, 2 of which have been tested as carriers. Her parents weren't tested...

Yes, I saw that too about her sire and dam, but then again, if he is not using them for breeding, not surprising that they are not tested considering their age... but seeing that she has two littermates that are carriers and knowing the pedigree, not really a total shock that she would be a carrier or affected.

And regardless now you know that something is going on and can get the bloodwork/blood gases done and get her on the protocol... fingers crossed that she does well on the protocol

You know, I am also really surprised that Kelli has not tested Cleo.

[sharronhurlbut]

I am so sorry that you have this test strip changing color.
But with the new protocal, you can have a long lived b.
Hugs and hugs.
Do keep us updated on what the vets say.

[Andrew]

Our thoughts are with you. We'll pray you can get to a vet that can do the proper tests & help you.

[Tayda_Lenny]

I have an appointment at noon today to get Tayda in for tests. I called back the place that originally said that they couldn't take the blood and talked to someone else, and apparently, it is not a problem and I should be able to walk out with the results I need. I'll be back with news!

meanwhile, I heard from the breeder who has Tayda's mother... it seems that she (the mother) has been affected and on the protocol for 5 years and is doing well. While its good to hear she's doing well, its NOT good to hear that she was affected and on the protocol BEFORE I got Tayda and her breeder never mentioned it to me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I know I'm still an idiot for not strip testing myself until now, but I really think he should have told me! I remember asking him about Fanconi when we were first discussing my getting a dog from him and he assured me his lines were clear. Of course, I didn't know enough back then to question it more or look into it myself. ACK!:mad:

[tanza]

I have an appointment at noon today to get Tayda in for tests. I called back the place that originally said that they couldn't take the blood and talked to someone else, and apparently, it is not a problem and I should be able to walk out with the results I need. I'll be back with news!

meanwhile, I heard from the breeder who has Tayda's mother... it seems that she (the mother) has been affected and on the protocol for 5 years and is doing well. While its good to hear she's doing well, its NOT good to hear that she was affected and on the protocol BEFORE I got Tayda and her breeder never mentioned it to me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I know I'm still an idiot for not strip testing myself until now, but I really think he should have told me! I remember asking him about Fanconi when we were first discussing my getting a dog from him and he assured me his lines were clear. Of course, I didn't know enough back then to question it more or look into it myself. ACK!:mad:

While we didn't have the test back then (when you got Tayda) so other then what the breeder tells you, there is/was nothing you could do to check, I agree that was uncalled for him not tell you the dam was spilling and certainly should have. I remember my first litter, Maggii's Dam started spilling 3 days before she was due to have her puppies. I made sure that anyone that was interested in a puppy knew up front that while do date, Maggii was stripping clear, her Dam did have Fanconi. I was lucky that Maggii never spilled nor did any of her pups. That is what makes the test so valuable now and the ability to see for yourself that the DNA Fanconi tests were done.

Good luck with the tests and let us know how it goes

[Tayda_Lenny]

Back from the vet! I don't have the urinanalysis or blood chemistry results yet, but I do have the blood gas results... it seems her pH is 7.32 - basically normal! and her pC02 level is slightly low at 42.9 (normal range being 45-47) There is a line that says "Glu 96 mg/dL" seems like that would be glucose and the normal range is 70-138 mg/dL from previous testing I had done.

So if it is fanconi, it *seems* like she would be on the lowest dosage of bicarbs - which i *hope* means we caught it early.

[Tayda_Lenny]

btw i sent all the results to Dr. Gonto directly since the vet didn't know anything about basenjis or fanconi...

[tanza]

btw i sent all the results to Dr. Gonto directly since the vet didn't know anything about basenjis or fanconi...

That was a smart thing to do.... you will have to see what Dr Gonto says about the blood gases and the rest of the results when you get them. And while again, I have not had a Fanconi dog, but sounds like you caught it early... Fingers crossed... let us know what Dr Gonto says.

[Tayda_Lenny]

Well, I heard from Dr. Gonto (what a lovely man!). He believes we caught it in the very early stages and recommended the minimum course of bicarbs. I have everything here with me and will start her on it tomorrow. And even though her urine work didn't indicate a UTI, I got a course of Clavamox anyway - Tayda is peeing a lot and in small amounts - seems very consistant with a UTI so hopefully it will help!

[tanza]

Well, I heard from Dr. Gonto (what a lovely man!). He believes we caught it in the very early stages and recommended the minimum course of bicarbs. I have everything here with me and will start her on it tomorrow. And even though her urine work didn't indicate a UTI, I got a course of Clavamox anyway - Tayda is peeing a lot and in small amounts - seems very consistant with a UTI so hopefully it will help!

Super... and yes he is a god sent to our breed.... fingers crossed that she does wonderful on the protocol.... and kudos to you for following up.... I still think you would benefit from the yahoo Fanconi list..

[tanza]

And by the way... many times.... a UTI is missed with a Fanconi dog... so I think it is smart to do a course of Clavamox...

With the Clavamox, know that it can cause some tummy upset... so just keep that in mind during the course of treatment

[Tayda_Lenny]

i joined the list yesterday! thanks for the suggestion... ill spend my day off tomorrow reading through the 10000 messages. :)

i gave tayda her first course tonight... 4 pills. 2 of them i just handed to her and she ate them... didn't even need to hide them. the other two i hid in cheese and she gulped them down. Lenny got 4 treats out of it too....

[tanza]

i joined the list yesterday! thanks for the suggestion... ill spend my day off tomorrow reading through the 10000 messages. :)

i gave tayda her first course tonight... 4 pills. 2 of them i just handed to her and she ate them... didn't even need to hide them. the other two i hid in cheese and she gulped them down. Lenny got 4 treats out of it too....

That is great news... super..... that is the biggest problem that people have... getting to pills down... again...kudos to you....that is such wonderful news... and glad that you joined the Fanconi list... it will be a big comfort to you to know that there are others facing the same challenges you are....

Hugs to you and Tayda... she has a great Basenji Mom!!!!!!!!!!!

[Schouiffy]

Congrats for stepping up and getting on with it - life I mean. I said it before, Tayda is super lucky to have you!

[sharronhurlbut]

The fanconis list is a wonderful group.
Glad your on there.
Please keep us informed on how she is doing.
Major hugs to you.

[bellabasenji]

Yes, definitely keep us posted on sweet Tayda's health!

[Ninabeana26]

Sorry to hear about Tayda but she is one lucky girl to have a mom like you! Hopefully it was caught early & she does well on the protocol. We are all here for you!

[Duke]

So glad to hear you've been able to get on with Tayda's care so quickly. Hope you're feeling a bit of relief, now that you talked with Dr. Gonto and her tests have been done.

Major kudos to you for getting the job done right. Best wishes for Tayda's health on the protocol.

[BasenjiByTheBay]

Thanks for sharing this journey. Lucky Tayda to have such a good mom, and lucky all of us B folks for Dr Gonto and for DNA testing and responsible breeders that may someday eliminate this scourge.

[Tayda_Lenny]

Thanks to everyone for all their good thoughts and advice. I really would be COMPLETELY in the dark about Fanconi if not for this forum, and at the mercy of these vets that know NOTHING about basenjis or fanconi. I was an idiot and didn't test her regularly, and I've lucked out in that it seems that her onset of Fanconi allowed a UTI to develop. If not for that UTI, and her peeing in the house right in front of my face, I would not have figured this out so soon. She peed on the rug in the living room right in front of me... and two days later, she peed on the couch where I normally sit. It's almost like she was warning me herself that something was going on that I should be paying closer attention to...

Dr. Gonto did tell me that by the time it gets to the point that the dog is drinking and urinating more (non UTI related), he/she could have been spilling sugar for up to 6 months already!

The worst part about this experience was finding a vet that had the capability of doing the blood gasses. Of course it had to be a weekend... and looking back I got a lot of mis-information from the people answering the phone. I confirmed a few times with the vet office that they could do the blood gasses onsite, and even then, the first thing the vet said to me yesterday after I got into the exam room was "you're not going to be happy, we don't have the cartridge to read the blood gasses." Ugh, I told her that I called and confirmed a few times and she said "weren't you the one that called and we suggested you go to Tufts or Angell?" and i said "yes, but that is 2 hours away and since then i've spoken to several members of the staff here who confirmed that you did have the machine and I clarified that it was not an arterial blood draw, but a venous blood draw that was needed." ACK. Turns out, even after all that clarification, she didn't realize what values we needed from the blood gasses and they did have the required cartridge. And she was trying to convince me that Tayda probably just had a UTI, and I said that sugar in urine is not normal for a UTI, and she told me that it IS possible...

Under less critical circumstances, I would have probably walked out of the office, but I just needed to get those blood gas numbers in my hands and into an email to Dr. Gonto....

Again, thanks to everyone for the support, this community is so awesome!

[tanza]

Good for you to "insist" that they do the Blood Gases and sticking it out till it was done.... and of course for sending them to Dr. Gonto... and I love the "it is possible" response... like we owners are totally clueless (yes of course some are).

Now, I am curious, what was her reaction to the Fanconi Protocol?

For those of you who don't have DNA testing on your Basenji, please consider getting it down now... with the swab test, it certainly is easier then sending in blood.... and for those of you strip testing, please consider doing it 3 to 4 days in a row, instead of just once a month... remember the strips only last 6months... better to get your money's worth out of them....

[Tayda_Lenny]

She didn't read the whole thing while I was there. I gave her a copy and had a copy for myself and I took her through the parts of it that related to getting the blood gasses and blood chemistries. We never really got to the part that discussed the supplementation. She admitted she knew nothing about Fanconi, and walked in with a book that had one little paragraph about it, and said, "I'm not sure this is Fanconi because it says here that onset is between 2-4 and Tayda is almost 6. I just kind of shook my head and said that less than 2 would be unusual, but later than 4 is normal. I think she knew that I was on a mission, that I had another resource for information that I was consulting, and that I was there purely as a way to get the numbers I needed. She did ask me to leave the protocol there with her, so I think if someone else comes in with a Basenji, she (and the other vets at that practice) will be better educated.

She did ask a few questions about who Dr. Gonto was, where he worked, etc etc... and I didn't know a lot of the answers. I just said that he developed this protocol and that many basenjis are doing very well on it, and it has become a standard for diagnosing and treating Fanconi dogs. She didn't really say much else. I mentioned that he is available for consultation for vets who have not come across fanconi yet, and she didn't seem all that interested in talking to him...

[tanza]

Interesting... and that is the way it seems to go... either a Vet is "interested" and takes the time to contact Dr. Gonto or they just file it in the "round" file.... Too bad, because that has been one of the biggest problems are Vets that don't know about Fanconi and do not diagnosis it correctly. Oh well..... main thing is that you got the blood gases done... and talked to Dr. Gonto. Do you have to find now a regular Vet that will be interested in learning about Fanconi?

[Tayda_Lenny]

I would like to. I still need a regular vet here... The basenji breeder near me recommended her vet - but the don't have the cartridge to do the blood gasses. I am thinking of calling them to see if they would consider adding that capability to their practice - since they already have the I-stat and would just need to order the cartridge... and they would get two new clients out of it!

worst case, i can go back to the same vet practice and try one of the other vets. it is a large practice with about 15 vets on staff so one of them is bound to be interested....i hope

[kiroja]

I have been keeping Michelle and Tayda in my thoughts too and am glad to see that, all things considered, the news is good! I was happy to help her start to sort through all this with her girl. Michelle is a wonderful mom and I know that Tayda is in good hands.

Also I hope everyone remembers to "test" their test strips. I have a dear friend who lost her girl way too soon to fanconi because her strips were bad and it wasn't caught early enough.

Pat, regarding your comment about my bitch Cleo, I have not tested her because there is absolutely no need to. I am well aware of the carriers and affecteds that are in the pedigree, and have dealt with diagnosing and treating a fanconi dog before so I am fully prepared for what potentially lies ahead. Thanks, but I'll save my money for the direct test. Blood/DNA has been in Missouri for several years, ready to go. I have been stripping her several consecutive times each month since she was a year old, and a marker test isn't going to change that. If she tests affected, that won't help me any, I'll still have to keep checking as i do, and I usually do it much more often than necessary anyways. If she tests better than affected, then I *could" stop stripping her, but probably wouldn't want to until the direct test. I continue to check my other kids occasionally even though the marker test makes them appear to be "safe". After all, it is JUST a marker test and not totally reliable. But it sure is a godsend! The marker test was developed as a temporary test for current breeding plans, and that's exactly how I'm using it. If/when any of my dogs are bred, both parents will be tested before hand, as I do with many other potential health risks. The boy Cleo lives with has tested clear, so no worries about an oops litter. Breedings were done before the marker test arrived, but the dog Cleo was bred to tested clear, so the puppies will be fine and no need to test her for that reason either.

Would I love to know what her results are? Absolutely! And I still encourage everyone I talk to to do the marker test if they want to for peace of mind. It's a wonderful tool. But my financial and living situation changed significantly last year (for the worse) so I'm not going to pay for a test I'll have to redo later, when it doesn't affect the onset of the disease. You can't treat it before it comes and the test doesn't help tell you when it's coming. Someday curiosity might get the best of me and I'll go ahead with the marker test. But for now I'm content where I'm at. For those who want to and can afford to test their whole household twice, kudos!

Pat, I don't know why you continue to throw out negative comments about me in these forums, but I would appreciate you going to the source in the future for the facts before making false assumptions.

The gang sends their love and baroos to Michelle, Tayda, and the Lenster!

[tanza]

Not sure what negative comments you are referring to... I only asked the question because if it were me I would want know.... what you do is your choice... but remember any of her pups that may or may not be a carrier could get bred to another carrier. Or if this goes back to the comments about neutering and the contract, sorry... I would say that to anyone and I was not the only one that made the same comments. And all I said was to me the most important thing is the home not if they show or not, contract or no contract.

[kiroja]

Yep, the home is the most important thing to me too. Why do think I placed Lenny with her in the first place? There was more than just that said, directly and indirectly. Had you bothered to contact me you wouldn't have jumped to the wrong conclusions.

And yes, what I do with my dogs is my choice, so I don't understand why you felt the need to bring up my bitch in a public forum when this discussion had nothing to do with her. Nor was I involved in the thread at that time.

All of the puppies are required to be tested when a full test comes out, no matter the type of home. Those that are intact, all but one are intact for my use only, and should the owners change their mind in the future, breedings have to be cleared through me. In those homes, there is no other intact dog. The one puppy that is in another breeder's home, is to be tested first and should he be a carrier (or IND), is only to be bred to tested clear dogs. There are no serious breeding plans for any of them at this time.

[tanza]

This thread is really about Tayda, not about your breeding or contract practices but that said, I jumped to no wrong conclusions, we were asked on a public forum about contracts and spay/neuter, if you read the thread. The comments made by me and others were our feelings on the subject

[kiroja]

Exactly! This thread is about Tayda, so why did you bring me and my bitch into it? Since you did, I responded.

And the same thing about previous threads. It was about one person and one dog and you continued to bring me and the rest of my dogs into it unneccessarily. You could have certainly been very helpful to the owner without going the route that you did. Things that should have been private. And had you contacted me, you would have realized that a lot of what was being said was innacurate.

[tanza]

Exactly! This thread is about Tayda, so why did you bring me and my bitch into it? Since you did, I responded.

And the same thing about previous threads. It was about one person and one dog and you continued to bring me and the rest of my dogs into it unneccessarily. You could have certainly been very helpful to the owner without going the route that you did. Things that should have been private. And had you contacted me, you would have realized that a lot of what was being said was innacurate.

Gezzz, Kelli, you are certainly getting pretty defensive? It was a question and since Lenny is an offspring of Cleo, I was really asking Lenny's Mom... Obviously knowing that the sire is clear is great for Lenny, because at worst he would only be a carrier.

About neutering, Lenny's breeder was never mentioned by name in those posts, Lenny's Mom was asking for advise about neutering and the fact that there was a contract, period. My comments were my personal opinion as a breeder and stated that way, as were the others that commented on that thread.

[kiroja]

Again, the thread was about Tayda. Not Lenny. And you already knew that Lenny was at worst a carrier so I don't know why you would bring him into a fanconi discussion either.

Yes, it was frustrating to see false things being said about me, the dogs, or the contract. Sorry, but I guess I expected better of you. No Lenny's breeder wasn't specifically named in that thread, but it was named in other threads and was easy to figure out if someone didn't already know.

I am not going to clog up this thread any further, let's get back to Tayda because that's who it's supposed to be about. If you want to continue this, you know how to reach me.

[JazzysMom]

How about the two of you take this conversation private since no one else is involved in your tiff -- and frankly, I barely know what the heck you're talking about, and I read almost every thread. Surely, I can't be the only one.

[tanza]

How about the two of you take this conversation private since no one else is involved in your tiff -- and frankly, I barely know what the heck you're talking about, and I read almost every thread. Surely, I can't be the only one.

I agree... my apologies to the Forum

[sharronhurlbut]

No need to for apologies, as a rescue person, I feel folks with intact dogs should have them tested.
Oops happen.
It fine if the oops is with a clear b, but what happens if its not??
Fanconis happens.

[bellabasenji]

Back to the subject... It's kind of funny that I live in WV (probably not the most progressive state in veterinary medicine). Anyways, the first time I took Bella in to see our small town vet & he brings up the subject of Fanconi! I was astounded that he was familiar with it. He knows about testing the urine for glucose and that the condition is not curable, but I haven't thought to ask him about the protocol. I am sure he would be open to it, though... Seems he must be VERY informed in pet health issues! So I guess there is hope after all, even in a small town. Of course he probably doesn't have the equipment for blood gasses, but I am sure another veterinary hospital I know of in a larger town nearby may have the equipment. That vet's office even treats the circus animals when they come to town!

[tanza]

Back to the subject... It's kind of funny that I live in WV (probably not the most progressive state in veterinary medicine). Anyways, the first time I took Bella in to see our small town vet & he brings up the subject of Fanconi! I was astounded that he was familiar with it. He knows about testing the urine for glucose and that the condition is not curable, but I haven't thought to ask him about the protocol. I am sure he would be open to it, though... Seems he must be very informed in pet health issues! So I guess there is hope after all, even in a small town. Of course he probably doesn't have the equipment for blood gasses, but I am sure another veterinary hospital I know of in a larger town nearby may have the equipment. That vet's office even treats the circus animals when they come to town!

And your best bet is to have the DNA test done... then you know where you stand as far a Fanconi goes....

And for many... blood gases can be done at a "human" hospital.... many years ago.. that was our only way of getting them done.

But that is great that your Vet knows and accepts Fanconi... if any Basenji is afflicted

[Robin_n_Jack]

Hey- if you do end up coming up to Tufts, let me know, I work right down the street, and there is a dog park not far, if you want to grab a coffee before the drive home and tire the kids out a bit :-)

[bellabasenji]

And your best bet is to have the DNA test done... then you know where you stand as far a Fanconi goes....

And for many... blood gases can be done at a "human" hospital.... many years ago.. that was our only way of getting them done.

But that is great that your Vet knows and accepts Fanconi... if any Basenji is afflicted
I know the importance, but I have mixed feelings too... I can't let my guard down even if the test shows "no worry". I will still want to strip test anyways for precautionary reasons. And if the test says she may get it, then I will worry like crazy and be anxious about every little thing. If I was a breeder, then absolutely no doubt about it, DNA would be a necessity! But Bella is spayed so that is not an issue... I would recommend the DNA test to all Basenji owners, but ultimately it is their choice. Of course if I were buying a pup from a breeder, I would insist on knowing about their DNA test results for Fanconi. But who am I to speak, I got Bella without research and without knowing about health issues. My hubby was uninformed about pet store puppies... she was a gift chosen by him. However, I want to tell everyone now how wrong it is to go about dog ownership in the way we did. Research the breed and buy from a responsible breeder... Now I know!

[tanza]

My personal opinion... do the DNA test and know where you stand... it is now easier then ever with the swab test... and IMO, well worth the $65 for the test kit and the test...

And regardless where you got your Basenji from... you can now test... and if you have learned more about how to find a responsible breeder, regardless what breed of dog... then those of us that put this information out there have helped people to know how and why to research a breed and health concerns before they decide to get a pup....again regardless of the breed... we know we have done a good job... Education is the key...

[sharronhurlbut]

Yes, education is the Key.
It will give you knowledge if you have a dog who can get sick, or help you realize that your b will not be affected.
Its so worth that fee. IMO

[Tayda_Lenny]

Hey- if you do end up coming up to Tufts, let me know, I work right down the street, and there is a dog park not far, if you want to grab a coffee before the drive home and tire the kids out a bit :-)

Hey Thanks, I almost did drive out there on sunday night before I finally got the appointment with the vet that I did go to. If I do end up out there some day, I'll let you know!

[Tayda_Lenny]

Well day 3 on the protocol and it all seems to be going fine. She gets 4 pills in the morning and 4 -5 pills in the evening. 3 of them i can just toss into her food bowl and she eats them no problem. I think she actually likes them more because she finds them first and eats them before the rest of her food. The other ones, the bicarbonate and the clavamox for her suspected UTI i just roll up into a piece of cheese. I give a piece of cheese to Lenny also and they just gulp it down w/o any suspicions...

Dr. Gonto thinks that the food I'm feeding tayda (wellness core) is too high in protein because her BUN levels are high. He's suggested that I get a food with more normal protein composition - around 18-24% protein, instead of the 34% that the wellness core has, to give her kidneys a little break. i looked back at her bloodwork from our last visit to the vet over a year ago and her BUN levels were high then also....

i'll be anxious to see how her levels are in 3 months when we go back... i might just schedule it for 2 months cause i can't stand the suspense...

[bellabasenji]

I am glad to see that she is doing so well! :)

[MacPack]

I am glad she is doing well, fingers crossed for many, many great years for her. Thanks to Dr. Gonto, many basenjis have a chance to live a good life with Fanconi. Glad your vet is working with you.

Anne

[MacPack]

You said she takes her pills well, that is great. Basenji Companion web site has a list of things to help with pilling fanconi dogs. With Toper's meds (for asthma) he will get bored with something and suddenly refuse it, so we go on to other yummies.
When all else fails, I put the pill in a dab of ice cream!

Anne

[Duke]

Tayda's a good girl for taking her med-meds. Another idea if she tires with the routine is a dab of baby food meat. My mom's idea worked great with my beloved Rocky a few years back.

[Rivermoon]

I'm sorry to hear Tayda has fanconi..but glad you caught it early and she's taking her pills like a good girl.