Basenji Puppies for Sale Ovid, MI

[thegriffswife]

Shelda and Michael Griffen
Ovid, MI :)
barclay14@msn.com - please contact me by e-mail, I would rather supply my phone number privately for seriously, interested buyers.
Unborn - Due in the next couple of weeks
Weight of Parents - Dam/Sire both about 27 lbs
Both parents get yearly boosters and health exams
AKC registered
$375
Puppies ready between 6-8 weeks of age to go to a loving home.
Will ship within the USA but the buyer is responsible for shipping charges including crate and other supplies.

All puppies will be dewclawed and current vaccinations. Our basenji's are red/white (sire) and brindle/white(dam). In our last litter we did had red/white, brindle/white and 1 tri-color.

We are not breeders, we had one litter 2 years ago and we decided to have 1 more before getting our female spayed. We have 3 basenji's, 1 we kept from our last litter, that we love and spoil a lot. Feel free to e-mail me for additional information.

[Schouiffy]

Have your dogs been tested for Fanconi?

[sharronhurlbut]

Where did you get your girl/boy from?

[thegriffswife]

No, they have not been tested for Fanconi.

We got our male from Grand Haven, Michigan. And we got our female from Massilion, Ohio. They are both from 2005 litters.

[mauigirl]

So....Fanconi testing costs about $130 for BOTH PARENTS which will be made up with the sale of one puppy...

Versus producing a litter of puppies at risk for a potentially fatal disease.

:(

[sharronhurlbut]

Oh, please do consider doing this test.
Its really the right thing to do for anyone who buys a puppy from you, as well as having the information on your 2 own dogs...
This knowledge is important for you to have..I hope you will consider doing the testing.

[Andrew]

Even if you're not concerned about the health of the puppies... at least consider this: many states have puppy lemon laws. If your puppies do develop Fanconi & a buyer gets upset, you can be held accountable as there is no reason for you to NOT get the test. This is a potential financial nightmare. Just a thought.

[tanza]

Please be part of the solution. If you have never seen a Basenji with Fanconi it is a horrible affliction and while in many, many cases the treatment works, there is no cure. Please test your Basenjis and save a person buying your pups the heartbreak if they were to develope Fanconi. There is no such thing as "Not in my Line"... unless you test. You can learn about testing at www.basenjihealth.org test is 65.00 per dog and you need to register them on the CPP site (that is free), but all the details are on the website. Help us all to rid our wonderful breed of Fanconi forever.
Also consider other health testing, it really is important to our breed... we have hip problems, elbow problems, eye problems, and thyroid problems that are all genetic.... be part of the solution to raise health, well adjusted Basenjis. Thanks

[phoenix3]

Sorry to change the subject but i was reading this post and had a question when does Fanconi usaully show up ? any age ? or is it when there alittle older ? also is there an age when u pretty much don't need to do the test say for example if ur B is 9yrs or so is it still needed then ? Just thought i would throw a couple questions out there .

[sharronhurlbut]

These are good questions.
Fanconis *usually* shows up around the age 3 or so.
If it shows up when the dogs are puppies, they often pass away quickly.
*this is my understanding, I know I will be corrected if wrong* laugh.
Are you breeding your 9 yr old?

[nomrbddgs]

Actually, Fanconi can show up later in life also, we've had some develop it when they were 11, 12 and even older. There is really no set age. Which is why when people say, "well, I have a contract for x number of years," I say, "not enough".

[Quercus]

We are not breeders, we had one litter 2 years ago and we decided to have 1 more before getting our female spayed.

Why don't you consider yourself breeders? Just curious....

[tanza]

Sorry to change the subject but i was reading this post and had a question when does Fanconi usaully show up ? any age ? or is it when there alittle older ? also is there an age when u pretty much don't need to do the test say for example if ur B is 9yrs or so is it still needed then ? Just thought i would throw a couple questions out there .

Fanconi usually will appear between the ages of 3 and 10, however there are cases of earlier then 3 and older then 10.

[thegriffswife]

I guess we don't consider ourselves breeders because when I think of a breeder I think of a business and waiting lists and such. I don't think of myself as a breeder because this is only the 2nd time our girl has had a litter and we are planning to get her spayed next year. The 1st time she got pregnant was kind of a accident, we knew we wanted to have puppies some day with her but we didn't want them then. We kept the two away from eachother but we were also in the middle of buying and moving into a house. We had a lot of fun with the puppies so we decided to have one more litter. I didn't mean of offend anyone because there is nothing wrong with being a breeder, I think I would like it if I were more serious about it. We only had puppies because we love our breed and want to share them that's all.

[sharronhurlbut]

I can tell you love your basenjis from your last post.
But now days, you need to do more...
Please, get the fanconis test done before you sell any of the puppies.
It will keep you informed as to the health of the dogs you have, and the pups you have.
We all love b's here.
I do rescue, and I don't breed...but we do have many breeders here and we all want the very best dogs on this earth...
I hope to hear you have decided to have the testing done.
We will all be waiting to find out what you decide.

[BasenjiDiva]

I think Sharron said it very nicely. And since you do love the breed, I would add another suggestion - have the people who buy your puppies sign a spay or neuter contract. I presume you don't want one of your pups to end up in a puppy mill or owned by a byb. Getting your dogs and puppies tested and requiring that the puppies be spayed or neutered would be some of the kindest things you could do for your puppies. Also, you might ask some of the breeders on this board how they screen their perspective buyers to ensure that they end up in basenji savvy homes.

Pat

[sharronhurlbut]

Pat, excellent suggestion..*blush* I can't believe I didn't suggest it, as rescue is my "thing"...laugh.
But thank you.
I am sure thegriffswife can get help from the breeders re suggestions on getting these pups fixes in writing...

Thank you again for this post.

[Quercus]

I guess we don't consider ourselves breeders because when I think of a breeder I think of a business and waiting lists and such. I don't think of myself as a breeder because this is only the 2nd time our girl has had a litter and we are planning to get her spayed next year. The 1st time she got pregnant was kind of a accident, we knew we wanted to have puppies some day with her but we didn't want them then. We kept the two away from eachother but we were also in the middle of buying and moving into a house. We had a lot of fun with the puppies so we decided to have one more litter. I didn't mean of offend anyone because there is nothing wrong with being a breeder, I think I would like it if I were more serious about it. We only had puppies because we love our breed and want to share them that's all.

IMO anyone who chooses to breed their dogs is a breeder. Some are responsible breeders, some aren't. When you make the choice to bring life into the world you are obligated to do the very best you can for those babies. I hope you will make sure your puppy buyers are responsible too.

[tanza]

IMO anyone who chooses to breed their dogs is a breeder. Some are responsible breeders, some aren't. When you make the choice to bring life into the world you are obligated to do the very best you can for those babies. I hope you will make sure your puppy buyers are responsible too.

Well said... and add to that ... any pups that you bring into the world you are responsible for their entire lives... good, bad, whatever..... regardless of why someone wants/needs to give up their Basenji, the breeder is responsible to take that pup... no questions asked... and that is usually in the contracts... and should be... (along with spay/neuter).

And to just comment on the "comment" about waiting lists.. that is how responsible breeders decide to breed, they have a list of homes before the breeding is done... not after... and if for some reason the planned litter doesn't work out.. responsible breeders will offer assistance to find another responsible breeder that would have a pup to place... or give the people the option to stay on the top of their reservation list for the next breeding.

[phoenix3]

Thanks for the answers :)

[khanis]

We are not breeders, we had one litter 2 years ago and we decided to have 1 more before getting our female spayed.


If you breed a litter, and this isn't the only one you've bred,
then you are, by definition, breeders.

Test your dogs, spare your puppy buyers the horror of possibly living with a Fanconi Affected basenji.

Been There. Done That.

AM NEVER DOING THAT AGAIN.
Thank god and allah that there is a test that allows us to breed away from this dreaded disease.

[dmcarty]

re: Pat's comment about 'forever' I have a guy here that is over 14 whose family just decided that their daughters friends coming in throught the gate to the back door - left the gate open and Wilie would go off on adventures. So rather than have the friends use the FRONT door - Wilie came back to me at age 9 . Was it convenient - nope - did I even give it a moments thought - nope - my breeding my responsibility.

Tried to place him a couple of times but - he was 'too old' and no one wanted him. It's hard for him to be one of several rather than have his own heat vent, couch and family but.......

[myran]

I don´t know how it is in the US but here in sweden you can have two litters after that you have to apply for a kennel name.I agree with the rest please test your dog´s for fanconi it´s the only way we can eradicate this hideous disease that has brought so much suffering to dog´s and distress to their owners.
You mentioned that pup´s are ready for delivery between 6-8 weeks please do not sell the pup´s before they are atleast 8 weeks it´s so important for their well being these last two weeks.

Good Luck with your puppies,Michelle Stockholm Sweden

[tanza]

No requirement in US for application for kennel name... The only requirement would be with AKC and DNA testing for parentage for frequent breeders

[myran]

We apply and then it takes awhile to get it accepted. In Finland they are even stricter there you have to pass a breeders exam it takes over a year to go the course then the exam and then your´re vetted to see if you pass and there are tough questions about genetics etc....And then you get your kennel name if it doesn´t already exist. As every name goes through the FCI(federation cynologicue International)database to see that no one else has that name like a kennel in brazil.And your kennel application is published in the national dogmagazine for 30 days where people can send a protest if they find your name too close to theirs or something else.

[Schouiffy]

heheh. that sounds so finnish =)

[tanza]

We apply and then it takes awhile to get it accepted. In Finland they are even stricter there you have to pass a breeders exam it takes over a year to go the course then the exam and then your´re vetted to see if you pass and there are tough questions about genetics etc....And then you get your kennel name if it doesn´t already exist. As every name goes through the FCI(federation cynologicue International)database to see that no one else has that name like a kennel in brazil.And your kennel application is published in the national dogmagazine for 30 days where people can send a protest if they find your name too close to theirs or something else.

I wish the US would do what the Finnish do.... maybe then we would not have as many BYB out there selling

[raye_hicks]

Have the puppies been born yet? What sex and colors did she have?

[thegriffswife]

She had the puppies on Dec 12. 4 males and 2 Female. The females are red/white. 2 of the males are red/white and 2 males are black/white. I didn't think it was possible to have black/white unless one parent is black/white. At least that's what I have read anyway I could be wrong. The mother is brindle/white and the male is red/white.

All of the puppies have a full white collar and white on their face from their noses to between their eyes. And of course they have the white feet/belly and tips of tails. They went yesterday to get their dew claws taken out.

The mother did wonderful and she's doing good.

[Quercus]

She had the puppies on Dec 12. 4 males and 2 Female. The females are red/white. 2 of the males are red/white and 2 males are black/white. I didn't think it was possible to have black/white unless one parent is black/white. At least that's what I have read anyway I could be wrong. The mother is brindle/white and the male is red/white.

All of the puppies have a full white collar and white on their face from their noses to between their eyes. And of course they have the white feet/belly and tips of tails. They went yesterday to get their dew claws taken out.

The mother did wonderful and she's doing good.

The 'blacks' are most likely tri or trindle, and their tan parts will show up later. You do have to have a black parent to get a black puppy.

[thegriffswife]

How much later may I ask?

We had 1 tri 2 years ago and we could tell right way, her cheeks and eyes were already red. We also had 2 extemely dark brindles last time as well but we could still see the color difference. I thought it was pretty crazy. Every thing I read points to not possible.

I'll keep you updated if any color changes.

[tanza]

How much later may I ask?

We had 1 tri 2 years ago and we could tell right way, her cheeks and eyes were already red. We also had 2 extemely dark brindles last time as well but we could still see the color difference. I thought it was pretty crazy. Every thing I read points to not possible.

I'll keep you updated if any color changes.

Usually within 5 to 7 days you will start to see the eye "pips" on a tri... and/or Trindle

[sharronhurlbut]

I see you did the dew claws, did you send for the fanconis test?

[Quercus]

How much later may I ask?

We had 1 tri 2 years ago and we could tell right way, her cheeks and eyes were already red. We also had 2 extemely dark brindles last time as well but we could still see the color difference. I thought it was pretty crazy. Every thing I read points to not possible.

I'll keep you updated if any color changes.


My tri pup was obvious right away. But I have heard of others that didn't show for several days. Also if they are trindle, you could have stripes in the red so it would look much darker.

[thegriffswife]

Thanks a lot.

No I have not done the test yet but I did contact the owner of the mother of my litter. She has both parents of my female--she said that they have been tested and neither have it.

I've read you can test their if their is sugar in their urine and if there is not then they don't have it. And the urine should be tested monthly and if it shows up then to get them tested. Is that true? Either way they will be tested way now that I have read more about it and am more informed.

[tanza]

Thanks a lot.

No I have not done the test yet but I did contact the owner of the mother of my litter. She has both parents of my female--she said that they have been tested and neither have it.

I've read you can test their if their is sugar in their urine and if there is not then they don't have it. And the urine should be tested monthly and if it shows up then to get them tested. Is that true? Either way they will be tested way now that I have read more about it and am more informed.

It is true that if you "strip" test the urine monthly you can tell if they have Fanconi on that day, however that is not the same as the DNA test that will tell you if they will get Fanconi... Since we now have a DNA test all breeding considered should have Fanconi tested DNA before the breeding takes place. That way you know if there could be Fanconi produced in that litter and NOT do the breeding... because now there is no reason to ever produce a possible Fanconi affected Basenji.

I would guess that the people that have the parents of your bitch have only done the month strip test, but not the DNA test.

[lvoss]

Thanks a lot.

No I have not done the test yet but I did contact the owner of the mother of my litter. She has both parents of my female--she said that they have been tested and neither have it.

I've read you can test their if their is sugar in their urine and if there is not then they don't have it. And the urine should be tested monthly and if it shows up then to get them tested. Is that true? Either way they will be tested way now that I have read more about it and am more informed.

This is not true. Urine testing only tells you the dog's status on that day and tells you nothing about whether it will produce the disorder since carriers will be unaffected but can produce the disease. You must do the DNA Marker Test to know if your dog carries the gene to produce the disorder. Also, since the disease is late onset, the dog or its parents may not yet be symptomatic but could still be affected.

If your dogs' parents are not in the OFA database as tested, http://www.offa.org, then they have not been tested and you need to order test kits for your dogs. https://secure.offa.org/cart.html

One parent must test Probably Clear to ensure that none of your puppies will ever be Affected. If neither parent is clear you will need to test all the puppies before placing them.

[sharronhurlbut]

Please, be more responsible than the folks who sold you the dogs you have...Test your breeding pair and test the puppies.
It will keep you informed if your dogs will become ill.
It will also tell you if your selling sick puppies.
IMO, in this day of lawsuits, its only smart to be sure you disclose to the buyers of your pups the status of their health.
This fanconis test will do that.

[swfseeksB2luv]

I guess i have my answer to the question you didnt want to answer for me... no the parents weren't tested. I guess you really do get what you pay for. Stacey from sarnia

[thegriffswife]

I'm sorry but I have been nothing but honest with everyone from the start. I told you from the start there were other prospective buyers, and in my email I told you they had not been tested.

The buyers that I chose have experience with basenji's by owning them and understand what it takes to own one. I have apologized multple times for not allowing you to buy one of my pups there is nothing more that I can do.

[mauigirl]

Basenji experienced people accepted that they were untested?

Regardless, seems like it was probably easier for you to go with the people who weren't giving you grief about that.

[Andrew]

I'll just reiterate what Sharon said.... in this day of litigation, you're really leaving yourself wide open for trouble later on. Now that there is a test for this (and in the grand scope of things, its relatively inexpensive), there is no reason you should be passing Fanconi on to further generations.
Thousands of breeders & owners have undergone the tragedy of Fanconi without fully being able to predict or understand its transmission. Now that there is a test, it is the responsible, and HUMANE thing to do.
If you knew you had a genetic disease & you knew you could have a test to determine if you would pass it on to your human children, would you leave it to chance or get the test done to prevent possible years of suffering and financial strain?

[swfseeksB2luv]

not allowing me? Never mind no harm intended, i prefer to know about the puppies future

[ChaseandZahrasmom]

not allowing me? Never mind no harm intended, i prefer to know about the puppies future

Not trying to add fuel to a fire here but from what I have learned since being a part of this forum it is up to the breeder to decided what is best for the puppy; from what I have read on this post it seems that Thegriffswife is trying to learn and become a responsible breeder you have to respect her decision on whether or not one of her pups is suited for you and your situation. Bravo to thegriffswife for trying to do that.

[sharronhurlbut]

Yes, I do agree that breeders do decide what is best for the puppies.
BUT quality breeders *or anyone who had a litter* for that matter, are responsible for the dogs they produce.
They SHOULD care about the long term health of the pups and be accountable.
I am taking about legally be responsible, as I have little doubt most people who have puppies do love them...BUT its more than that.
They are selling a *product* and in the country, if you get something defective and you COULD have prevented this from happening, you can be taken to task.
Rehoming puppies to the right home, that is another issue.
Having puppies and not having every test done that can/should be done, is what I am speaking of.

[swfseeksB2luv]

well i was finished with griping about this, as there was alot of details missing in this thread, i wanted a female, and we had spoke of a payment arrangment. i had replied asking about whether the pups were tested to which a response came saying that they were sold and that the males were still available. now because i posted a reply i was suddenly unsuitable? I was simply miffed because i had already let my son know that he was getting a red and white female puppy who he had named, and had a picture of. I truly believe that had we said we would take a male there would be no issue. (and i could post the note if it was really neccesary, ehich i dont believe it is.) nonetheless i decide to do some research here to see if they were tested or posted here, and in fact they were, and in fact they are not tested so we as a family decided to go with a safer choice with regards to health for all concererned so my son would not have to witness life a possibly sick animal. (irregardless of price.) I meant no ill intent or to start a tiff here but the truth of the matter is it was first come fisrt served, on some best buy puppies, with the outcome of thier lives being buyer beware. i have to say thank you to the entire basenji community for putting the information out there about the risks of faconi, which was what gave me a pasue in deciding to place my down payment.

[sharronhurlbut]

I can only hope the new owners of these puppies learn about the fanconis test and do it.
Course, if they don't and they breed, well, guess that is where rescue comes in.
SIGH!

[snorky998]

And may I add....BRAVO to swfseeks.., for not purchasing a pup that could turn out to be affected.

Glad that griffswife is going to test in the future. That in itself doesn't negate the fact that irresponsible breeding has already occurred, and there are untested bitches, studs, and pups in the gene pool.

Placement of pups is a HUGE factor in our breed. However, breeding pups just to be placed, is an abomination.

Hang in there swfseeks. A certified healthy pup is on the way to you if that's what you truly feel, and your house will be a forever home for one of these crazy 'kids'.

[swfseeksB2luv]

A final note, we are looking for a basenji puppy, color and sex now undetermined( we had chosen the name rosey for a female, but could revisit this process) which is faconi tested, for a family pet which comes to under 675 us shipping includued (as we are canadian) air shipping would be to detroit.

[sharronhurlbut]

You might have to do some saving to make sure the funds are there for a responsible breeder, but once that is taken care of, you will not be sorry that you waited.
Dogs are our companions, I have heard of breeders *who don't test* say, we will take the dog back and give you another.
Heavens!!! this animal isn't a sweater from Nord's that you take back...we all fall in love with the dogs and want to keep them with us.
So, do let us know when you find your forever pup!

[swfseeksB2luv]

I sure will and thank you :) It is my hope that all those puppies are just fine too... Here to hoping anyways

[ChaseandZahrasmom]

Yes, I do agree that breeders do decide what is best for the puppies.
BUT quality breeders *or anyone who had a litter* for that matter, are responsible for the dogs they produce.
They SHOULD care about the long term health of the pups and be accountable.
I am taking about legally be responsible, as I have little doubt most people who have puppies do love them...BUT its more than that.
They are selling a *product* and in the country, if you get something defective and you COULD have prevented this from happening, you can be taken to task.
Rehoming puppies to the right home, that is another issue.
Having puppies and not having every test done that can/should be done, is what I am speaking of.

Sharon,

I totally agree with you and I think that thegriffswife is learning and will hopefully become a responsible breeder from everything that we all chat about. I help out with BRAT and know what happens when someone does not go to a responsible breeder and ends up getting in over their head.

As for SWF, I am sorry that your query into getting a basenji did not go so well and I hope that you will find the right little guy or girl for you with a breeder that you feel comfortable with, you are right that testing is very important and it should be done my statment was to support thegriffswife because I feel that she is new at this and is trying to set things right. I hope I am right. As I said, I did not want to add fuel to the fire but I didn't want to see her getting bashed if she is trying to learn to do the right thing.

Is there any chance there may be a B you could be interested in through BRAT? Good luck with your search.

[Andrew]

Dogs are our companions, I have heard of breeders *who don't test* say, we will take the dog back and give you another.
Heavens!!! this animal isn't a sweater from Nord's that you take back...we all fall in love with the dogs and want to keep them with us.

That's a phrase I've never understood. Once I'm attached to my dog, I don't want a replacement!!! I agree with, its not a sweater you return because its defective. Its a living breathing unique individual with its own personality. Nothing could ever replace one of these guys.

[tanza]

Not trying to add fuel to a fire here but from what I have learned since being a part of this forum it is up to the breeder to decided what is best for the puppy; from what I have read on this post it seems that Thegriffswife is trying to learn and become a responsible breeder you have to respect her decision on whether or not one of her pups is suited for you and your situation. Bravo to thegriffswife for trying to do that.

That part is great... decided where to place the pups... NOT testing for Fanconi is NOT

[ChaseandZahrasmom]

That part is great... decided where to place the pups... NOT testing for Fanconi is NOT

I agree totally

[dmcarty]

I have a question on peoples opinion (legal if you are a lawyer) Given that most states have a puppy lemon law that requires you to replace OR reimburse up to the price of the puppy for any genetic disorder visible by 1 year. If there is a fanconi test and a puppy buyer purchased a puppy and later did the test and found out it was affected - I think that would be sufficient grounds to sue in small claims court to get your money refunded.

I will be interested to see the first test case - cause I bet there will be one.

[agilebasenji]

Yes, but if you are refunded your money, would you have to return the dog? After all, in the eyes of the law, dogs are *just* property.

[lvoss]

I think it depends on the state but the class action law suit that was filed several years ago in California against a breeder of labradors who continued to breed and place puppies from parents known to produce hip dysplasia without disclosuring this fact to the buyers was seeking the amount of full hip replacements for each of the diagnosed puppies. This was significantly more than the purchase price since they said each hip joint would run $2000 and most of the puppies needed both sides replaced.

[Janneke]

I have a question on peoples opinion (legal if you are a lawyer) Given that most states have a puppy lemon law that requires you to replace OR reimburse up to the price of the puppy for any genetic disorder visible by 1 year. If there is a fanconi test and a puppy buyer purchased a puppy and later did the test and found out it was affected - I think that would be sufficient grounds to sue in small claims court to get your money refunded.

I will be interested to see the first test case - cause I bet there will be one.

I do wonder if it isn't part the responsibility of the puppy buyer.. What if the breeder tells the buyer that de parents aren't tested? Then the buyer takes that risk, right?

The breeder of the Labradors was lying (or holding back important informations), but what if a breeder is totally open about his not testing?

[dmcarty]

Actually since the puppy lemon law covers cost damages - one could argue that the vet fee's should be covered (but again only to the price of the dog is typically the court damages)so it would essentially be reimbursement for future vet bills.

Re knowing or not knowing on the part of the buyer - how many people in THIS list were told something that is clearly not right about fanconi testing or not testing - and believed it. It is human nature to develop a relationship with folks we talk to and then believe them. (and get really mad when someone points out something that is a significant concern) I think that it would be unreasonable for ALL buyers to know which information is fact and which information is not fact.

So much is dependent on what is in the contract or bill of sale - how to prove that someone asked and got the answer and bought anyway?

It'll be interesting when someone does do this to see how it plays out.

[wyliebailey]

Hello,

We are looking for a red/white female. We live in Wisonsin around Green Bay and would love all the information you could give me in regards to your puppies once they are born. You can contact me at johnson8903@yahoo.com or 920-737-5319.

Thank you,
Monica Ditewig